in other words, you can't even get latinos in the door to listen to the message you have about the economy, about health care, about education. because they're so turned off by the rhetoric about illegal immigration. and that i think is what ari and the republican party is talking about now. >> so john berman has covered politics for a gazillion years. richard, you are my nonpolitico. are you moved? is there a sense of a relaunch? >> i'm the type of person that i'm to be persuaded, right some but to me, i know especially this 18 to 29 group, i just feel like it seems like marketing. and i hear the word brand and to me that makes it seem that it's not authentic. so i think social issues, but this idea of the package and -- it just seems like a branding and a marketing thing and i think a lot of young people are pretty wise to that sort of approach. >> so let's go right back then to jake. when you look at the cpac, right, and the straw poll that came out of that, you had rand paul winning with 25%, right behind was marco rubio, something like 23%. and you had contra ticker to me contradictor